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NinjaServe.org Forums » Gamer's Zone » General Game Discussion » Liquid metal cooling

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Old 06-09-2005, 11:11 AM   #1 (permalink)
Fook_Yu
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Liquid metal cooling

I came across a thread regarding liquid metal cooling (www.nanocoolers.com). Any of you spend it some thought? With gallium mp=30°C and gallium/indium mp=16°C it is a very nice technology. I'm calculating a bit on the system. If any of you is interested to work it a bit through then it would be nice. Just to not make wrong assumptions.
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Old 06-09-2005, 01:15 PM   #2 (permalink)
Fook_Yu
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Try to follow me a bit and see if i didnt make a error:

If i take the Zalman CNPS7700-Cu as a ref:
http://www.zalman.co.kr/eng/product/...45&code=005009
It has a thermal resistance of 0,19-0,24 °C/W
(surface coils=0,3268m2 !!!!, if you use the 0,19 and calculate backwards you get a Length of your coils totalling 25 meters!! insane)

With 150 watt generation by the CPU it would mean you need to cool the surface of the coils with 28,5-36°C to keep the CPU at a stable temperature.

Based upon AMD64 Athlon:
Pnew=Pspec x Vnew/Vspec x Fnew/Fspec => 150=89 x 1,9/1,5 x 3500/2600
(just to calculate with something)

Gallium:
CPU watt generation = 150 watt
Surface heat transfer = 0,0014m2
a) Heat transfer coeff = 2,4x1E5 W/m2.K (flow rate 2 cm/s)
b) Heat transfer coeff = 5x1e4 W/m2.K (flow rate 0,1 cm/s)

A)
150=240000x0,0014xdT => dT=0,45°C
B)
150=50000x0,0014xdT => dT=2,14°C

So again if you can cool down the flow of Gallium with more then 2,14°C then you can get ride of the 150 watt and keep the Tcpu stable.

(click here to see the calulations of the Heat transfer coeff.)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...k-Yu/gal01.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/Fook-Yu/gal2.jpg

I will continue with the calulation of a thermal resitance number for the heatsink needed to facilitate this in a moment. I will not spend time on the convectivity of the Gallium flow => heatsink as i can pretty much make the surface several times larger then that of the CPU, thereby assuming that the thermal resistance of this part will be of no or extremly little influence.

Assumption:
- Energy los in piping is minimal => 150 watt remains
- heat transfer coefficient turbulent air through finned plate 50 W/m2.k (this is high!! and definitly not soundless)

150 = 50 x A x (dT)

Option 1) CPU temp 30°C air 20°C
A => 0,3 m2 (that is the heatsink of the Zalman and we already noticed the problems with the thermal resistance in that unit)

Option 2) CPU temp 40°C air 20°C
A => 0,15 m2 only halved, not enough.

So working with a liq. metal will enable you to transfer almost any rate of heat development (watt) from your cpu at soundless level. But you get in troubles cooling the gallium down with air inside your PC. Making a system that leaves your PC will be to expensive with a price of 3$/g of Gallium (remember the density of 6 kg/L).
Then you could compine it with something else. However as you can't go below the 16°C you can forget using phase cooling to directly cool the gallium, because you will freeze your medium.
What remains is a combined system of watercooling and liq. metal. Guess how the do it in nuclear plants were the idea of using liq. metal for cooling was taken from . But A system with only water will be enough to pull the heat It is simply a matter of flowrate and water temperature.

No advantage then what so ever. i really think not for a CPU. Simply because the temp levels are not extreme enough. Gallium has one huge advantage not that it start to melt at 30°C but it first starts to boil at 2200°C.

Why use it in a graphics card? I guess because you can reduce your overall thermal resistance by enlarging your contact surface. AND because a GPU produces less watts then a Cpu that make it possible to have a small air cooled circuit.

If i made a mistake in my assumption please comment!!!?
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Old 06-09-2005, 02:11 PM   #3 (permalink)
Bonez
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wow, that thing looks REALLY heavy(looks like complete copper construction)

the zalman 7000B ALCU has a disipation area of 3,145cm^2 and forcing air through the fins. dropping the average temprature(based on stock cooler from manu) by 10 - 20 degrees.

now that liquidmetal system because of the materials, weight, cost completely voids the thermal potential gained.

personally, water systems, air, and phaseshifting is still the most cost effective and has a better gain then the(LARGE for one) expensive liquidmetal system.

sure it's interesting, but it's overly large(so fitting it on a motherboard along with all the other things popluating the pcb) and probally weighs allot too.

now if they found a magic metal to make it weigh less, take up less space, and still give the same or more heat disipation then it might catch on, but it looks like a niche product to me.

that and these look much prettier.
http://www.zalmanusa.com/mboard/mboa...&order_da=desc
http://www.zalmanusa.com/usa/product...48&code=005009
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Old 06-09-2005, 02:16 PM   #4 (permalink)
Horsepower
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heh. you guys must still be in school. once upon a time i used to know how to do those calculations, but then i graduated and have never seen anything like them again.
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Old 06-09-2005, 02:27 PM   #5 (permalink)
Fook_Yu
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:-) nope it has been a while since i made them (i must also say i would not put my hand in the fire for some of these assumptions). Just like you i graduated and started to do something completly different.

I made a small change to the initial post. As I spent a bit more thought about it during dinner (one of the lovely dishes i once posted). In the start the thermal conductivity of 29 W/m.K got me pretty enthausiastic about liq. met. cooling, but after running through the numbers i think Watercooling is still the most efficient. However i cant help it, i just think water and electronics should be kept as far appart as possible.

Have you ever thought about using sunflower oil instead of water? it has a freezing point of -17°C. I have no clue how the rheology is of sunflower oil at -17°C and it has a lower thermal conductivity.

Or like this (probably repost: http://www.tractum.de/

I looked a bit at cooling these last days and i must say the benefits of a VapoChill is totally lost on me.
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